Walter couldn't tell his Mexican parents about the pressures he faced in college and law school. And when he decided he needed a break before taking the bar, he faced increased self-doubt.
If you loved this episode, listen to Walter's original episode, He's the First to Go to College.
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Juleyka Lantigua:
Hi everybody. This week, we're continuing with another installment of OG Check-Ins, the occasional series where we speak to our OGs, original guests, to catch up with them and learn what's been going on in their lives since we last spoke. Today, I'm checking in with OG Walter. Walter's episode aired on June 15th, 2020. Here's the clip.
Clip: I was saying goodbye to some friends and some teachers came up to me to congratulate me as well. One teacher in particular, she hugs my mom and she says, "Do you know how big of a deal it is for your son to get into a school like Brown?", I remember when mom kind of looked at her and smiled, didn't want to answer the question too much. Then the teacher answered the question herself. She said, "It's a huge deal!". I remember it's just my mom looking at me, staring at me for a couple of seconds. There were so many challenging moments at Brown, that goes without saying.
Lantigua: When Walter first came on the show last year, he was still in law school at Northwestern University. At the time he had been living at home in LA with his parents because of COVID. And during our conversation, he reflected on what it was like being the first in his family to go to college and then to go to law school. He talked about the difficulty in conveying both his challenges and his triumphs to his parents. So for our OG check-in, I wanted to hear how it's going after finishing law school and getting ready for what's next professionally. Let's get into it.
Walter: Hi, it's great to be here. My name is Walter Garcia. The last time that we chatted, I was in law school. It was the summer. So it's almost a little bit over a year ago now. I was living at home because of the COVID pandemic, obviously, and the difficulty that, that led to, and the many changes that it led to as well.
Lantigua: Welcome back.
Walter: Thank you. It's great to be here.
Lantigua: Yeah. I'm so happy that you came back. What was it like listening to your episode, if you remember from so long ago?
Walter: I hadn't listened to it in quite some time and listening to it, I think was odd for many reasons. First and foremost, hearing your voice is always a little bit weird, but I think most importantly, you kind of realize that some things change and others don't. For me, the things that change were that now I'm in a different position. I'm now officially a law school graduate. I'm super happy to do it. And I was glad that I was able to do it with honors. Definitely a big thing. In terms of things that don't change, I quickly realized, I remember at some point I was talking about the difficulty of sharing with the parents and kind of bringing them into the fold. You realize that the challenging nature of that doesn't really change. It's something that was good for me to remember and has allowed me, I think, to a certain extent to find some peace in terms of realizing that communication generally with people, me with my friends, with partners, whatever it might be, it's challenging.
Lantigua: So how was that, finishing, graduating? I mean, that's a pretty big deal.
Walter: It was difficult. I think the COVID measures made life difficult for all law school students and people generally, obviously, to be stripped of human contact. That was one of the things that allowed us to stay sane. That was certainly not easy. But for me, turning in that last assignment felt like the biggest thing in the world, to a certain extent. My folks immigrated to this country from Mexico with a sixth grade education, as I mentioned in my first episode, and it's a big deal. They don't quite know the stress that I had to go through to do it. I was immensely proud to be able to get that out of the way. Now it's time for me to take the bar, which I'll be taking in February now.
Lantigua: So was there some sort of ceremony, even virtual, that your parents were able to witness this rite of passage that you had just achieved?
Walter: Yeah. It was interesting because of COVID, as most things were at the time and continue to be, there was a ceremony by which you could either attend in person, but you couldn't actually be with your fellow sons and daughters, so you'd had to wait outside of the actual law school, or you could see it virtually. Obviously I wish the circumstances could be different. We were planning to have neighbors and family from all over the country there, but it's still a huge badge of honor. I'm very, very happy to have done it because it was very, very difficult.
Lantigua: So, I know that we talked while you were in law school and that it was sometimes really difficult for you to convey to your parents the enormous stress, the amount of work and the pressures that you were under. After you finished, and after you had a little bit of distance, were you able to give them a sense of the size of the accomplishment?
Walter: Not quite, it seems most other people tend to do their work for me. They'll tell my parents “Oye, ¿si saben lo que hizo su hijo? Está muy difícil.” I'm just kind of there, lingering in the background, like, oh, you know...
Lantigua: Looking at the ground, [crosstalk 00:05:51] oh you're talking about me, okay.
Walter: I do think from my perspective, I don't want to worry them too much, and I don't want to overly concern them with how challenging it was. So it's something that I frankly think I still need to work on because parents are... They can tolerate hearing the rough stuff. I think for me, it's just about how much rough stuff do I tell them? I think all I did was I told him "It was really, really difficult.", and at the end, I remember telling my mom that I was stressed, but my sentences were very short. I was never very descriptive. I usually said “está difícil esta tarea, muy complicada,” something like that.
Walter: I think probably the most difficult, I think to do, it didn't get any easier once I graduated to be completely honest; I, and most, almost all students tend to take the bar in July. I decided to postpone that, I decided to postpone it until February.
Lantigua: Why?
Walter: I was just feeling really burnt out.
Lantigua: Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Walter: I was feeling really, really exhausted. Pacoima, where I'm from, was one of the hardest hit areas in the country at one point in terms of COVID, and there was a big responsibility I felt on my shoulders to take care of my own immediate family, neighbors. I, probably a small part could have done it. If I really, really pushed myself, but I had never in my life, frankly, taken some time to really look after myself, take care of myself. It was a very, very, very challenging decision to take, because I frankly felt like I was letting myself down. Like I was letting my family down, my future employer down.
Walter: When I communicated that to my parents, it was really odd, I think. I told my mom first about my not taking the July bar and instead deferring to February because we have a closer relationship. So that felt like that was going to be easier. She just looked at me and said, "Okay, if that's what's best for you, then do it." she's always incredibly supportive, but doesn't say much. I think in part, because she doesn't really understand what it entails. I've just told her it's a really miserable experience on top of all the other miserable things you've already done. I didn't tell my dad, I was planning to tell him later, but my dad, at some point while I'm outside in our backyard, he says, "So, I heard that you're going to, not take the exam," and I said, "That's right." He said, "So, what are you going to do?" Just kind of like...
Lantigua: What's the plan then? Give me the plan.
Walter: It's this very immigrant mindset where you constantly need to keep busy. I think we mistake to think like that all the time, because I was really, really running on fumes at the very end when I turned in my last assignment. As I began to study for the bar, I realized that I was just in need of some self love, and I'm glad that I was able to take the time. I got support not only from my fellow law school peers whose support and love means the world to me, but also from my firm. A Latina, which never is the case, is a partner at my law firm. It meant the world to be able to see somebody who looked like me, who I knew was one of the kindest individuals I've ever met. I told her what was going on and she moved heaven and earth to make it happen, to allow me to postpone taking the bar until February and to start working.
Lantigua: Let's pause here, people because that's called sponsorship, right? This is the next level of mentoring where someone in a position of power makes things happen in your favor. What a phenomenal example of that. So you've been studying, you're living at home, how's that going for your sanity?
Walter: We all have different ways of studying. For me, I enjoy some peace and quiet, and it's very difficult to get at home when I have my parents, when I have my niece, when I have my sister. I needed to be creative and to figure out something that could work for myself as most kids of immigrants need to do, you need to be creative. You need to hustle in some way. Luckily I have a friend who is going to let me crash at his place for a little bit while I study and I'll have my own room and I'll have my own peace and quiet there. It's difficult to also have that conversation with my parents about; hey, I love you guys, but I need to bounce for a little bit, but at the end of the day, I've been working so hard towards my goal of becoming an attorney, this is perhaps the most important thing for me to do. Like I said, it's all about figuring out what works for you and for me. I think one of the things I needed to work on was boundary setting enough. I've tried to do it in numerous ways. Exercising, therapy, making sure to spend time, not only with family, but with friends who matter to me. Reading books that I like, watching movies that I like. So I try to engage in that self love as best I can.
Lantigua: That's wonderful. So, have you experienced a shift now that you are not in school and really headed into your permanent professional future? Have you experienced a shift in the expectations, the perceptions coming from your parents and your family?
Walter: I have been away from home since college since I went in 2010 and I didn't really come back until last year. It's almost a decade, if not a little bit more. It's interesting now that I'm back home, what's become increasingly clear and perhaps goes as no surprise as a kid of lower income immigrants is, there is that financial expectation that you kind of feel coming on into the horizon. I'll be working as an attorney, so I'll be making for the first time in my life, pretty good money.
Lantigua: Yeah.
Walter: I've been at home now for several months since graduating in May. You realize how many things need to change, how many things need upgrading, but because of our financial situation, they've not really been taken care of. Ever since I've been at home, I've been trying to find creative ways to help, whether reaching out to friends, hey, do you know who does this, who does that? Or trying to bargain with people, kind of tell them, Hey, I got this price from this plumber, what price can you get me? I learned that at my negotiation class at law school. So there's...
Lantigua: Look at you putting your education to good use.
Walter: Trying to. I think the financial expectation is definitely something that I'm aware of. My folks are getting older. My dad's a construction worker. He can't work construction his entire life. It's very hard work.
Lantigua: Yeah.
Walter: So I know that at some point I'll have to step in and help out. So I need to figure out how I can best do that too.
Lantigua: So I was... The very first time that you and I spoke, I was really impressed, and I think I might have mentioned it to you with just the level of self-knowledge that I perceived from you, and I'm so gratified to hear that you've only grown in that respect.
Walter: Oh, thank you. And it doesn't come from myself. I feel blessed to have wonderful family members. Mom, dad is difficult at times, can be with them. They're also great in terms of showing me the light. Sister, my niece [Layla 00:13:34], and I have wonderful friends in my life too. Along those lines, you're reminding me of the importance of therapy. I think especially as Latino males, I find a number of my friends who have a lot of trauma that they've experienced, that they don't want to talk about and that they don't ever deal with, and that ends up pouring over into other aspects of the relationships. It creates a toxicity, that's bad. So I definitely want to give a shout out to all men of color and encourage them to do it because we're not only going to make better partners that way, but also better human beings generally, for all the world. It's made the world of a difference. Sometimes you need somebody to listen to, and it's hard to open up, but a lot of times a therapist goes a really long way.
Lantigua: Walter, thank you so much for coming back on the show. It's been so good to catch up with you.
Walter: No, thank you as well. I appreciate it greatly and I hope that folks continue to tune into your show.
Lantigua: Walter's original episode is called He's The First to Go to College. You can find it in our feed and on our website. We've also linked to it in the episode notes. Thank you for listening and for sharing us. How to Talk to Mami and Papi about Anything is an original production of LWC studios. Virginia Lora is the show's producer, Kojin Tashiro is our mixer, Manuela Bedoya is our social media editor, I'm the creator Juleyka Lantigua. On Twitter and Instagram we are @talktomamipapi. Please follow us and read us on Apple podcast, Amazon music, Pandora, Spotify, anywhere you listen to your favorite podcast. Bye everybody. Same place next week.
CITATION:
Lantigua, Juleyka, host. “OG Check-in: Feeling the Pressures of Being the First to Graduate College.”
How to Talk to [Mamí & Papí] About Anything,
LWC Studios., November 29, 2021. TalkToMamiPapi.com.