For the next few episodes, we're checking in with some of our early guests. When we spoke last year, Merk Nguyen, podcast co-host and producer of Adultish, was struggling to be more than a dutiful daughter to her Vietnamese parents. Recently, she's had a realization about her identity, that led to a very important conversation with them.
If you loved this episode, listen to Merk's original episode, Struggling to Become More than a Dutiful Daughter.
We’d love to hear your stories of triumph and frustration so send us a detailed voice memo to hello@talktomamipapi.com. You might be on a future episode! Let’s connect on Twitter and Instagram at @TalkToMamiPapi and email us at hello@talktomamipapi.com. And subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and anywhere you listen to your favorite podcasts.
Juleyka Lantigua-Williams:
Hi, everybody. Juleyka here. As you know, we started making the show almost a year ago, and we’ve learned so much. We’ve met so many cool first gens and we’ve talked to some of the smartest people thinking about and working through intergenerational relationships. Sometimes it’s been funny, sometimes it’s been wild. In January, the team and I decided to go back and check in with some of our early guests to find out how things have been going since we had them on the show, so for the next few episodes we’re visiting with our OGs, original guests.
Today, I’m checking in with Merk.
Merk’s episode aired on June 1st and here’s a little bit of what she shared with us back then:
Nguyen: The conversation of the move was actually pretty smooth, because I’ve always been a career-driven person. My parents know that. I work in podcasting now, but I have ambitions to be in voiceover, and Hollywood, that’s a great place to go. And so, they were actually really supportive of that, but I think what they don’t know is although I say my career is a big reason why I moved, it has a lot to do with my parents, actually. Growing up the youngest of three, in a very tight knit family, I’ve had strong associations with my identity following into the same identity as my family’s, and a lot of the time when I feel like I’m struggling with my mental health and everything, it’s because I’m asking myself, “Who am I?” Because without my family, I feel like I’m nothing, like I don’t have… My parents, they left Vietnam, they got here, were able to build a life for my siblings and I, but it makes me wonder when I’m home, am I acting in a certain way because I think that’s how they want me to be? Or am I doing this because I am truly this way?
Lantigua-Williams:
The minute I came on the line to do the follow-up interview with Merk, she completely blew me away. Her energy, her charisma, I mean, I could literally hear her smiling on the other side. It felt like I was talking to a completely different person and she shared that since we last spoke, she’d had a really important conversation with her parents. Let’s get into it.
Nguyen: What’s up? I’m Merk Nguyen. Last time I was on the show, I had just moved to L.A. and I was figuring out who in the world I was, and now I think I got a better idea of who she is. Yeah, a proudly queer, Catholic, daughter of Vietnamese immigrants, first generation lady girl, who’s anxious and left-handed.
Lantigua-Williams:
That was so perfect. Anxious and left-handed. Oh my god that should be a sticker. I love it. So, you listened back to yourself these many months later. What stuck out to you when you were listening?
Nguyen: Okay. Well, you gotta know that I stayed up so many nights replaying this episode. You know those 3:00 AM thoughts where you’re like, “What am I doing? What is the meaning of life? Why am I here?” I did that so much. So, some things that stuck out were… So, funny enough, when Sara, the therapist, was like, “I specialize in seeing first gen and queer clients,” I’m like, “Oh, that’s very interesting.” Because when I went home to Washington in December of 2020, I came out as queer to my parents.
Lantigua-Williams:
What?!
Nguyen: And now you know. Now you know, so I’m like, “Damn! Juleyka knew me from the beginning. There was no hiding my cards.” Yeah.
Lantigua-Williams:
Oh my God! First of all, I’m so happy for you. Oh my God, I’m so happy. So, now of course you need to tell me everything about that. First of all, how did you realize it?
Nguyen: I think… I mean, it’s something that I’ve kind of always known, but I’ve just repressed all my life, and part of the reason why I didn’t want to come out so openly was because I come from a Catholic family. However, I still am Catholic today, and I used to think that, “No, there’s no way I could be queer and Catholic. That just doesn’t exist.” But I started-
Lantigua-Williams:
Okay. I’m making funny faces as you say that. But okay.
Nguyen: I know. I know. I was making funny faces at myself too. So, as I started my process to get confirmed in the Catholic church, I met people who helped me realize that the way that I am and the way that I love is 100% okay, and so just a lot of things led me to accept my faith, but also my queerness. So, those are kind of like my yin and yang.
Lantigua-Williams:
Okay. That’s so beautiful. And then you tell your family.
Nguyen: Yeah, so I told my sister and brother earlier that year, but it was the week before Christmas when I told my mom and dad separately.
Lantigua-Williams:
So, what did you actually say to your mom and then why did you want to talk to them separately?
Nguyen: Well, I wanted to talk to them separately because sometimes my dad overrides the conversation, or he just totally mansplains, and it’s so painful to watch, and my mom and I will look at each other and roll our eyes. So, I was like, “You know what? This is a big thing. I want to see how each of them reacts separately, because I know it’ll be different.” And it’s just a feeling that I had in my heart. So, for my mom, I talked to her during a lunch break at home, and I sat on her bathroom counter, and I was like, “Hey, I gotta tell you something.” She was like, “Okay, go ahead.”
And it took me a while to spit it out, and I’m like crying and all. She’s like, “Hey, you know what? It looks like whatever you’re about to tell me, you’re actually not ready to tell me.” And I’m like, “No! No, no, no, no. I swear, I am.” And she’s like, “Okay. Well, I’m just saying you don’t look like you’re ready.”
Lantigua-Williams:
Right. Mom being mom. Comforting you.
Nguyen: Yeah. And I was leading up to, “You know, this has been true all my life,” and you know, I am in a long-term relationship with a straight cis male. Samuel. He is the love of my life. That man is very much going to be my husband. However, not that I have a ring on my finger, however, ever since I started dating him, it’s interesting because I have been able to fully be myself with him, and with that comes me exploring my sexuality, and so this is something him and I have been dealing with for all of our relationship, which has been four-plus years.
But anyway, so I told her it’s been true all my life, Samuel knows, and he still accepts me. And she goes, “Oh, let me guess. You’re pregnant.” And I’m like, “No!” And then she’s like, “Okay, okay.” She’s like, “You have another lover in L.A.” I’m like, “Mommy, no. Oh my gosh, just let me talk.” And she’s like, “You’re just taking so long!” I’m like, “Okay.”
And then I was like, “Well, I don’t just like guys, I…” And she finishes my sentence. “You like girls too.” And I was like, “Basically, yes.” And she’s like, “Okay. That’s normal.” For me, it’s like I know this is true, and I’ve had other experiences with females, so it just took quite a bit of explaining, but all in all, at the end my mom was like, “Okay. Well, you know, whether you are, you aren’t, and you are, I love you just the same because you’re my kid.” And I was like, “Can I have a hug?” She’s like, “Yeah! Of course!”
And then-
Lantigua-Williams:
Oh my God.
Nguyen: Oh, and then this woman gets salty because my partner’s mom knew before my own mom, and she’s like, “So, I guess you had to tell her before me.” And I was like, “Oh my God.”
Lantigua-Williams:
Oh, oh.
Nguyen: So, there’s just all this stuff, but I was like… Well, she knows.
Lantigua-Williams:
But you know what, though? That is such a normal reaction. It just really emphasizes how she’s just like, “It is what it is. You’re my kid. But wait a minute, wait a minute. You, what? You told her before you told me?” Like that is such a normal mom reaction.
Nguyen: Totally.
Lantigua-Williams:
Oh my God. Okay, and then when you told your dad?
Nguyen: So, when I told my dad, right before that I was already… I had this very strong spiritual experience in my living room where I just felt the spirit of my ancestors and I was like speaking in rapid fire Viet, just like praying, and being like, “Thank you so much for my life.” All this stuff.
So, I'm already in an all-over-the-place place. However, my dad, he comes home, he’s like, “Hey, you know, I got tacos for lunch. I’ll be in the kitchen. You want to join me?” I’m like, “Nah, I’m okay.” And then something in me was like, “Go to him.” So, I go over to the kitchen and I give him a hug and I’m like, “Hi, và.” He’s like, “Oh, hi, [inaudible 0:10:17.6].” He’s like, “Oh, why are you crying?” And in my family, for me to cry is very normal, and I’m like, “I’m just so happy.” And he’s like, “Oh, you’re happy? That’s so great!” And I’m like, “But I need to talk to you about something.” And he’s like, “Okay.”
So, I sit right in front of him and he’s eating his tacos, and I give this long preface of like, you know, I’ve come into my faith this year. I’m looking at the crucifix that Jesus is on for strength and I’m like, “You know, I’m just feeling really good about my life, and Jesus said the truth will set you free, and so in light of that, I’m embracing a lot of my truths, and và, I want you to look at me when I say this.” So, he looks me in the eyes, and I go, “I don’t just like guys. I like girls too.” And he stares at me for a second and then he goes down to his tacos and continues eating. And I’m like explaining more of my journey and why I want to come to this truth, and part of it was because 2020, we all saw so much death, and so because of that, I’m like, “You know, if I were to have my parents pass for that kind of reason, I would want them to know who I am.”
And I was also inspired by someone who was a guest on my podcast, Adult ISH, Juan. He was undocumented and his dad got deported, and after his dad got deported, while Juan was in high school, he realized anything can be taken away from you. I need to come out to my family. And so, he goes by him/they. They told their family, and I was just really like, “You know what? I want to be like Juan, I want to be like Jesus, so let me just be honest with people, including myself.”
And then my dad kind of hit me with the questions of… Well, actually, the first thing my dad said when I told him was, “Okay, that’s normal. You have a cousin in Vietnam who’s gay, too, and people are born that way.” And then he’s like, “But why would you do that to Samuel?” And I was like,”Và, like you just said, I didn’t choose to be this way. And I’m just saying if anything were to happen to Samuel, God forbid, if I came home with a woman or someone else who was not a cis man, I wouldn’t want you to be surprised.” And we kind of went back and forth and he was like, “Well, you know, I was born in a man’s body, but I’m supposed to have a wife, and God created Adam and Eve, male and female, so I’m born in a man’s body. There’s nothing I can do about it.”
And for a second, I thought, “Is he trying to tell me something?” And I was like, “Và, do you know how it is I feel? Have you felt this way before?” He goes, “No, no, no, no. I’m just saying.” So, he was just cautioning me in not letting my temptations get the best of me, to be a faithful partner, and all this stuff. And so, I was like, “Okay, that makes sense.”
And then after he left, I told my siblings and my sister was like, “Actually, you know, và called me right after and was just so confused.” And she told him to ask me questions if he had any, or to ask her questions, and then after I got off the phone with my siblings, my dad’s like, “Hey, your brother invited me over for dinner.” And I’m like, “My brother’s probably gonna say stuff to my dad just to get him to get it.” And after that night, nothing was ever brought up about it again and my life with my dad was able to resume as normal, which is what I wanted.
Lantigua-Williams:
What did your brother say to him? We need to know.
Nguyen: I know! I keep on forgetting to ask him, but he said something.
Lantigua-Williams:
He might have solved this for so many people. We need to know what he said.
Nguyen: On the next episode of…
Lantigua-Williams:
Exactly! First of all, I am so proud of you. Holy cow! You’re like a whole nother person. I can feel your strength just vibrating through our conversation. It’s such a powerful thing.
Nguyen: Thank you.
Lantigua-Williams:
Oh my God. Merk, this is incredible. All right, so this clarity, right? And this sense of self has to have manifested in other areas in your life.
Nguyen: Oh, yeah.
Lantigua-Williams:
Because you’re just so, like you’re standing so firmly in it.
Nguyen: Fun fact, it’s powerful women like you that inspire me to ask for promotion, which is what I’m doing. I’m asking to be a senior producer of Adult ISH.
Lantigua-Williams:
Good. Good. Good. So, is that part of this sort of like taking charge, being fully yourself, and wanting to be fully recognized for all of your strengths?
Nguyen: Yes. I think once I was able to just be like, “Okay, you know what? All these parts of me are me and I’m gonna go with it and just have it be present in all parts of my life.” So, on my show, our senior producer is leaving, and with that, I’ve been just asking him, “You know, what truths do you have to reveal to me about myself? In your eyes, as my supervisor, how have I grown?” And he was like, “Well, once you came out to your family, there was something totally different about you. There is truly no stopping you now. It’s like you’ve always been a grounded person, but your seed has now been rooted and now it’s just time for the rest of us to watch you sprout.”
And-
Lantigua-Williams:
Wow.
Nguyen: And he was like, “On some days, I think you see that, but on many days I don’t think you do.” And you know, I still… Something that I’ve struggled with is imposter syndrome, and also just anxiety, and just a fluctuation of moods. Highs and lows constantly. And just to know that despite those uncertain feelings, I know who it is I am. I know my worth and I know that every year I live, that worth is just gonna grow and grow. And I’m really happy to recognize that in myself, but I know there’s so many people who don’t have that. They don’t have the same story that I do. They don’t have the same privileges that I do, or the family, or the support system, and that is why I want to give back.
I’m okay. I’m good. And I can help people.
Lantigua-Williams:
Oh my God. I am smiling so hard right now. What a story arc. And to-
Nguyen: I mean, I… Oh, so sorry.
Lantigua-Williams:
No, no. Go for it. Go for it. Go for it.
Nguyen: I just want to say thank you for this show, because without this show, and without us talking, I wouldn’t… I don’t think I would have been able to come to the conclusions, or like where I am at in my life right now.
Lantigua-Williams:
Merk, you’re a gift. Thank you for coming back to the show.
Nguyen: Well, thank you for having me. You know, time is the best present, so let’s make the gift count.
Lantigua-Williams:
If you haven’t yet listened to Merk’s original episode, called Struggling to Become More Than a Dutiful Daughter, which aired on June 1st of 2020, you can find it in our feed and on our website, and we’ve also linked to it in the episode notes for this episode.
How to Talk to [Mamí and Papí] About Anything is an original production of Lantigua Williams & Co. Virginia Lora produced this episode. Kojin Tashiro mixed it. Manuela Bedoya is our social media editor. Cedric Wilson is our lead producer. I’m the show’s creator, Juleyka Lantigua-Williams. On Twitter and Instagram, we’re @TalktoMamiPapi. Please subscribe and rate us on Apple Podcasts, Amazon Music, Spotify, and anywhere you listen to your favorite podcasts. Bye, everybody. Same place next week.
CITATION:
Lantigua-Williams, Juleyka, host. “OG Check-in: From Being a Dutiful Daughter to Being Fully Herself.”
How to Talk to [Mamí & Papí] About Anything,
Lantigua Williams & Co., February 8, 2021. TalkToMamiPapi.com.